Very curious if anyone is into speed wing foiling?
How fast have you gone?
What gear do you use?
Thx 
Some folks in SF say they hit 35 knots. Personally I've only hit 25mph on both an ART999 86cm carbon mast, and on a mikes lab 110cm mast, both overpowered (~20knots of wind) on a 6m and flattish water. The Art was stable and didn't need any more front foot pressure over 20mph. I had lots of pull from the wing and I feel it could go faster with more wind.
ML had a lot more runway on the top end and I haven't fully opened it up yet, but I have to adjust the positioning of it since I ran out of front foot pressure to keep it down. These foils regularly go 40mph.I hope to do over 30 knots this spring on the ML.
Select to expand quoteJohnnyTsunami said..
Some folks in SF say they hit 35 knots. Personally I've only hit 25mph on both an ART999 86cm carbon mast, and on a mikes lab 110cm mast, both overpowered (~20knots of wind) on a 6m and flattish water. The Art was stable and didn't need any more front foot pressure over 20mph. I had lots of pull from the wing and I feel it could go faster with more wind.
ML had a lot more runway on the top end and I haven't fully opened it up yet, but I have to adjust the positioning of it since I ran out of front foot pressure to keep it down. These foils regularly go 40mph.I hope to do over 30 knots this spring on the ML.
Great video of speed and racing talk^
hello, what model of ML are you using?
I'm starting with an ML 1100 and it feels wonderful but at the moment I am not past 20 knots, I had to delay the foil on the board due to excessive pressure on the front foot.
I am a 70kg rider and that can penalize me, I notice a lot of lift and glide but to go really fast I may need the ML 800
I'm on an old windfoiling 640 with a normal length fuse. ML has shimming instructions on his website where super thin shims are put at the mast/fuse connection and you torque the bolts to a specified amount.
I can't give you more info and I certainly can't speak for ML. I think shimming the tail to a lower AOA relative to the front wing should create less front foot pressure at higher speeds but make takeoff harder. Delta foils has a good video on this for measuring the angle of incidence. Or just move your mast back/straps forward. My mast is slammed back so I'm going to shim the foil and get an appropriate torque wrench.
Other riders don't have this problem (see Heineken sup foiling the 1100 on YouTube) so I think it's likely a setup issue.
Ideally you can ride with your feet in the straps from takeoff to top speed, but you might want to err on the side of balanced feet at +20knots and be back foot heavy at low speeds and transitions.
Im no expert so I'd just contact ML or someone who has more experience.
On SAB W671 (570 cm2) / S399 and Naish matador 5m wing and 60L board, I maxed at a bit over 22 knots
I'm also trying to push my limits. So far my max is 25,4 knots. My goal is to reach 50 kmh (27 knots). Conditions and setup hasn't been ideal so far. I have used the Armstrong HA925 and HA195 tail. I was still using the 72cm mast. In choppy water this makes it very challenging. Switching to the 85cm mast will give loads more control (I hope).
I have been riding the HA725 as well, but the speed is about the same. This tells me I am still the limiting factor. It is about control and how hard you dare to push.
There is also still some tuning to be done. :)
Very interesting, thanks for the info.
20.08 knots is my best 2 sec peak on wing kit so far.
The gear I use is:
5.2m Reedin SuperWing
112L Reedin FeatherWing board
1280cm? Reedin FlightAttendant foil
I did that speed in about 15 knots of wind ish.
I have no idea how fast the Reedin gear can go. I don't think the foils are specifically designed for speed but I still feel like it could have gone quite a bit faster. I just don't have the control yet. 
Btw, I very much doubt is a true "sinker" board is going to be faster. As ArtemN I am riding the 60 liter Armstrong. I feel I can push that board much harder compared to my 34 or 27 liter board. The shape of the board seems more forgiving on accidental touch downs.
Plenty of decent speeds, usually a very fun game.
I have a custom 5m wing I built myself and have had decent time with Axis foils.
31 knots on - HPS700, 420, 86 mast. I've been riding the ART799 recently a fair bit, had a decent session a few weeks ago but I'm unsure of speeds, I had my band snap on my watch and lost my GPS data for the session. I was only on a 4m wing in 30knots, but decent sea state to scream down at TWA 130. Didn't feel much more than 25-28 knots, but the ART feels more locked in at speed. When really ripping with the 700, I feel very limited control, and the foil is producing maximum lift.
I'm looking to build a custom ART799 scaled down to 530cm2 for actual speeds.
19.8kts using a 5m Duotone Unit and a 920 HSP AXIS front foil - pretty choppy where I sail though, reckon I could get a bit more with a smaller front foil and flatter water
www.strava.com/activities/6285999378
21 knots is my peak speed to date. That was on a HA925 and chopped V tail riding with a +1 shim (zero). Aside from that one time, I consistently can hit around 19-20 knots on HA725 and chopped v with no shim (-1).
I just picked up the HA195 so I'm curious how that will impact things.
These speeds are in surf and chop conditions.
Really interested issue, thanks for posting! Always asking wingers their top speed, but not everyone cares about this. I really do since I feel winging slower than kitefoiling. Personal records:
1. 22knts on 700hps and 400ha rear, 90 mast, custom board of 80L, Vayu Vving 4m and 15-18knts of wind.
2. 21knts on art999 and 420ha rear, 90 mast Vayu Vving 5.4 on same wind conditions.
Just get art799, but havent tried yet, really looking forward to have wind conditions. I saw Foiltycoon posted on instagram 26.3 knots on art999 with 400 progressive rear. I have not heard good things about these new progressive rear wings, but would like to try them.
Select to expand quoteEmiD said..
I saw Foiltycoon posted on instagram 26.3 knots on art999 with 400 progressive rear. I have not heard good things about these new progressive rear wings, but would like to try them.
That is crazy fast compared to where I top out on pretty much that setup (ART999 with 400P, Ultrashort fuse, 19mm 820 mast).
When I ride the 999 it will hit 30 kph with zero effort, but then it starts to get lifty. When I'm nudging 35 kph, I feel like I'm on the edge of blowing out of the water. Must take some serious skill to hang on to a 999 at almost 50 kph.
p.s. If you are after top speed, you'll probably want the 380 rather than the 400p, but the progressive rears are a great match for the ART999.
Select to expand quoteDTee said..EmiD said..
I saw Foiltycoon posted on instagram 26.3 knots on art999 with 400 progressive rear. I have not heard good things about these new progressive rear wings, but would like to try them.
That is crazy fast compared to where I top out on pretty much that setup (ART999 with 400P, Ultrashort fuse, 19mm 820 mast).
When I ride the 999 it will hit 30 kph with zero effort, but then it starts to get lifty. When I'm nudging 35 kph, I feel like I'm on the edge of blowing out of the water. Must take some serious skill to hang on to a 999 at almost 50 kph.
p.s. If you are after top speed, you'll probably want the 380 rather than the 400p, but the progressive rears are a great match for the ART999.
I also freaked out with Foiltycoon mark on art999... Are progressive rears more difficult or unstable to ride?
Select to expand quoteEmiD said..DTee said..EmiD said..
I saw Foiltycoon posted on instagram 26.3 knots on art999 with 400 progressive rear. I have not heard good things about these new progressive rear wings, but would like to try them.
That is crazy fast compared to where I top out on pretty much that setup (ART999 with 400P, Ultrashort fuse, 19mm 820 mast).
When I ride the 999 it will hit 30 kph with zero effort, but then it starts to get lifty. When I'm nudging 35 kph, I feel like I'm on the edge of blowing out of the water. Must take some serious skill to hang on to a 999 at almost 50 kph.
p.s. If you are after top speed, you'll probably want the 380 rather than the 400p, but the progressive rears are a great match for the ART999.
I also freaked out with Foiltycoon mark on art999... Are progressive rears more difficult or unstable to ride?
If others are noticing excessive lift at 30kph, you might find he's used an negative shim in the tail or mast plate. The only way to gain control when maxing front foil is to reduce tail as much as possible.
That being said, with a negative shim, and those speeds, the 999 might make a very good wing for its massive range
Select to expand quoteEmiD said..
.. Are progressive rears more difficult or unstable to ride?
I think they are easier to ride when pushing max speed.
Benchmarking speeds can be found at gps-foilsurfing.com
Most of the Garmin gadgets are not very good at accurate speed recording. Good info on recording also on gpsspeed
I'm intermediate level with a few different winging combos.
Naish Jetfoil 2000 tops out at about 20 kmh for me.
Axis png 1300 and BSC 1060 (fuse 88cm and 500 rear) also top out at about 20-23 kmh.
Axis 900 (windsurf foil specific with 88cm fuse and 500 rear) tops out 42 km/h. Speed isn't really my driver for winging, but it staggered me how much faster that smaller foil went compared to the bigger HA foils with everything else the same.
Also touched down a couple of times at high speed with a Konrad 118L board. The smooth frontal under shape meant it bounced off the surface and just kept going without me going over the handlebars. A wide flat nose on my other board would have stuck much more - probably resulting in a faceplant.
Not sure if this was mentioned previously, but PPC baseplate shim vid talked about some shimming their baseplates when speed wining to allow a more nose up ride so any accidental touchdowns are more likely to skip back up rather than dig, and also allow more front foot pressure style riding.
Select to expand quoteKing Crash said..EmiD said..DTee said..EmiD said..
I saw Foiltycoon posted on instagram 26.3 knots on art999 with 400 progressive rear. I have not heard good things about these new progressive rear wings, but would like to try them.
That is crazy fast compared to where I top out on pretty much that setup (ART999 with 400P, Ultrashort fuse, 19mm 820 mast).
When I ride the 999 it will hit 30 kph with zero effort, but then it starts to get lifty. When I'm nudging 35 kph, I feel like I'm on the edge of blowing out of the water. Must take some serious skill to hang on to a 999 at almost 50 kph.
p.s. If you are after top speed, you'll probably want the 380 rather than the 400p, but the progressive rears are a great match for the ART999.
I also freaked out with Foiltycoon mark on art999... Are progressive rears more difficult or unstable to ride?
If others are noticing excessive lift at 30kph, you might find he's used an negative shim in the tail or mast plate. The only way to gain control when maxing front foil is to reduce tail as much as possible.
That being said, with a negative shim, and those speeds, the 999 might make a very good wing for its massive range
Axis provide a 3D Printer file for the Negative Shim (-1 degree): axisfoils.com/collections/all-wind/products/axis-foils-3d-printing-files-1-degree-rear-wing
I got a friend to print one of them for me, and it made a big difference to the liftyness of the ART799 at high speed, and also the tendency it had to lift/engage really agressively on takeoff (on the kite at least). I haven't tried to go super fast yet, but I have two similar tracks around 41kph (again on the kite) - one before and one after the shim. The second run was a lot more neutral and I wasn't needing to put all my effort into keeping the wing down.
It doesn't seem to impact the lower speed riding at all, at least not stall speed wise, just makes everything more neutral.
I haven't tried it on the ART999/Wing yet - just haven't had a chance - but I'm hoping it will be a similar story there, and then I'll just always use the shim with the ARTs.
Select to expand quoteJonesey32 said..King Crash said..
If others are noticing excessive lift at 30kph, you might find he's used an negative shim in the tail or mast plate. The only way to gain control when maxing front foil is to reduce tail as much as possible.
That being said, with a negative shim, and those speeds, the 999 might make a very good wing for its massive range
Axis provide a 3D Printer file for the Negative Shim (-1 degree): axisfoils.com/collections/all-wind/products/axis-foils-3d-printing-files-1-degree-rear-wing
I got a friend to print one of them for me, and it made a big difference to the liftyness of the ART799 at high speed, and also the tendency it had to lift/engage really agressively on takeoff (on the kite at least). I haven't tried to go super fast yet, but I have two similar tracks around 41kph (again on the kite) - one before and one after the shim. The second run was a lot more neutral and I wasn't needing to put all my effort into keeping the wing down.
It doesn't seem to impact the lower speed riding at all, at least not stall speed wise, just makes everything more neutral.
I haven't tried it on the ART999/Wing yet - just haven't had a chance - but I'm hoping it will be a similar story there, and then I'll just always use the shim with the ARTs.
Thanks for info and sharing the file!!??
I'll try a neg shim with strong wings.
I'll just add that I looked at my gps track and actually I hit over 27.8mph on a 640cm foil. However I realized the limits of wrist mounted gps units looking at my track and I don't trust those numbers.
All garmins and Apple Watches only measure position once per second and can't really be considered accurate at all for peak speed.
The gps forum has a DIY solution for about 40$ to build a 10x/second gps to accurately log speed, which I'll be building and will keep on my back to check races and speed runs. Pretty excited.
FYI the latest gopros and garmin cameras record location at 10hz as well.
I really like the Waterspeed App for the Apple Watch. It gives you top 2 sec, 5 sec, 10 sec etc. so you know if that top speed was an anomaly. Also allows you to enter/select 3 types of equipment for each session and enter notes. You can check speeds for each foil etc over multiple sessions. Here's a recent flat water session on the Armstrong 926 and 195 tail.
Select to expand quoteEmiD said..
Really interested issue, thanks for posting! Always asking wingers their top speed, but not everyone cares about this. I really do since I feel winging slower than kitefoiling. Personal records:
1. 22knts on 700hps and 400ha rear, 90 mast, custom board of 80L, Vayu Vving 4m and 15-18knts of wind.
2. 21knts on art999 and 420ha rear, 90 mast Vayu Vving 5.4 on same wind conditions.
Just get art799, but havent tried yet, really looking forward to have wind conditions. I saw Foiltycoon posted on instagram 26.3 knots on art999 with 400 progressive rear. I have not heard good things about these new progressive rear wings, but would like to try them.
I've been looking at the art799. Would be interested to see how you go with it. I would be happy to do anything over 25 knots of speed on a wing. That is my goal
I think it is possible, especially on these art foils. Everyone seems to say they are very fast!
Select to expand quoteDJMax said..EmiD said..
Really interested issue, thanks for posting! Always asking wingers their top speed, but not everyone cares about this. I really do since I feel winging slower than kitefoiling. Personal records:
1. 22knts on 700hps and 400ha rear, 90 mast, custom board of 80L, Vayu Vving 4m and 15-18knts of wind.
2. 21knts on art999 and 420ha rear, 90 mast Vayu Vving 5.4 on same wind conditions.
Just get art799, but havent tried yet, really looking forward to have wind conditions. I saw Foiltycoon posted on instagram 26.3 knots on art999 with 400 progressive rear. I have not heard good things about these new progressive rear wings, but would like to try them.
I've been looking at the art799. Would be interested to see how you go with it. I would be happy to do anything over 25 knots of speed on a wing. That is my goal
I think it is possible, especially on these art foils. Everyone seems to say they are very fast!
I have both ART 799 and HPS 700. I have been having more sessions on the 799, but still prefer 15-19 knots on the 700. I also take the 700 down range to about 13-14, but pointing upwind can be a bit of a struggle. Still. I'm doing 20 knots in 14 knots. Love being able to whip into a turn and spin out in super tight turns. The 799 is fun, but I'm still not sold. I want a 599 
Select to expand quoteKing Crash said..DJMax said..EmiD said..
Really interested issue, thanks for posting! Always asking wingers their top speed, but not everyone cares about this. I really do since I feel winging slower than kitefoiling. Personal records:
1. 22knts on 700hps and 400ha rear, 90 mast, custom board of 80L, Vayu Vving 4m and 15-18knts of wind.
2. 21knts on art999 and 420ha rear, 90 mast Vayu Vving 5.4 on same wind conditions.
Just get art799, but havent tried yet, really looking forward to have wind conditions. I saw Foiltycoon posted on instagram 26.3 knots on art999 with 400 progressive rear. I have not heard good things about these new progressive rear wings, but would like to try them.
I've been looking at the art799. Would be interested to see how you go with it. I would be happy to do anything over 25 knots of speed on a wing. That is my goal
I think it is possible, especially on these art foils. Everyone seems to say they are very fast!
I have both ART 799 and HPS 700. I have been having more sessions on the 799, but still prefer 15-19 knots on the 700. I also take the 700 down range to about 13-14, but pointing upwind can be a bit of a struggle. Still. I'm doing 20 knots in 14 knots. Love being able to whip into a turn and spin out in super tight turns. The 799 is fun, but I'm still not sold. I want a 599
What does the 700 feel like doing 20 knots? Is it stable? Does it feel like it wants to go faster?
I am coming to wing-foil from kite racing (regularly hitting over 30kn) so the speed stuff is interesting to me. I have only just learned to water start reliably on the wing-foil but can gybe and foot change once up. Last week I raced at JBSC in Perth which was interesting, one of the wingfoil racers in between racers tried a kite-foil race board and foil combo and water started it as a sinker with his 6m wing in about 25kn, he got up no worries. But he said it actually wasn't much faster than his current foil, which looked to me like a wind-foil racing setup with long carbon mast and HA large wing etc. I think he said he's hitting the high 20s.
In Europe the wing-foil race scene is taking off, I work with Gin Kites and we are developing a race wing for general sale, we are hoping that is a growing market. The regular free-ride wing is coming out next month (called the Detla - I'll have demo wings for anyone to try) and the race wing the "Alpha" is coming out in April. ginkites.com/en/produit/maax-wing-racing-coming-soon/ if you click on 5m you can see a picture of what the race wing will look like and there are also pics of the Delta wing on the same site. My intention is to keep working on my starts until I can launch my kitefoil race board/foil (Levitaz R5) and to see how fast I can go with the Alpha wing when i get them.
Select to expand quoteDJMax said..King Crash said..DJMax said..EmiD said..
Really interested issue, thanks for posting! Always asking wingers their top speed, but not everyone cares about this. I really do since I feel winging slower than kitefoiling. Personal records:
1. 22knts on 700hps and 400ha rear, 90 mast, custom board of 80L, Vayu Vving 4m and 15-18knts of wind.
2. 21knts on art999 and 420ha rear, 90 mast Vayu Vving 5.4 on same wind conditions.
Just get art799, but havent tried yet, really looking forward to have wind conditions. I saw Foiltycoon posted on instagram 26.3 knots on art999 with 400 progressive rear. I have not heard good things about these new progressive rear wings, but would like to try them.
I've been looking at the art799. Would be interested to see how you go with it. I would be happy to do anything over 25 knots of speed on a wing. That is my goal
I think it is possible, especially on these art foils. Everyone seems to say they are very fast!
I have both ART 799 and HPS 700. I have been having more sessions on the 799, but still prefer 15-19 knots on the 700. I also take the 700 down range to about 13-14, but pointing upwind can be a bit of a struggle. Still. I'm doing 20 knots in 14 knots. Love being able to whip into a turn and spin out in super tight turns. The 799 is fun, but I'm still not sold. I want a 599
What does the 700 feel like doing 20 knots? Is it stable? Does it feel like it wants to go faster?
Oh yeah 700 is super stable over 20. I can hit 20 in 15 knots of wind, super comfortable and easy to hit this too. I've been working on moding and now hitting these speeds on all points of sail. But off the breeze, yeah it really rips and I'm yet to max it out.
RE the Levitaz R5, one of the guys is riding this in the World Series. He rips hard with it and very very fast. Hence the line on 599, an axis version of this foil would be nice!
I'm surprised not more people have joined the wing group on ka72.
www.ka72.com/Groups/Group-Activity/groupid/69
Select to expand quoteKen767 said..
I'm surprised not more people have joined the wing group on ka72.
www.ka72.com/Groups/Group-Activity/groupid/69
Agreed Ken 
Also what gear do you use to do 26 knots? That is really fast for winging!
