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Flysurfer Soul 12m

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Created by chino > 9 months ago, 2 Aug 2018
chino
VIC, 165 posts
2 Aug 2018 10:07PM
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So, full disclosure. I've been asked to write this review by Marv, normally I wouldn't bother. But I just texted him to say how happy I am with his service and the kite and I was asked to write a positive review so I am.

I've been happy in my little freestyle/wakestyle rut for 5+ years, and have been upgrading boards and kites every 1-2 years but haven't progressed much. Still ride C-kites with a TT and boots and do some basic unhooked stuff, but don't really boost high, etc etc. Lately I've been looking at expanding my sessions into something a little different, and picked up unstrapped on a surfboard and have been enjoying it. And then I stupidly talked to some foilers, and now I am giving that a crack, mostly so I can do some light wind stuff and kite in new countries with a little less wind.

Anyways, so to cut a long story short, I end up buying a Flysurfer Soul 12m from Marvin - it took less than 10 days from the time I messaged him to the time we actually received the kites at our front door - even though I've never flown foil kites (paraglided a bit, but not for 10+ years). My friend buys the exact same kite.

We drive down to Rosie today where it is forecast for 20-30 knots and as usual it's a bluff and blowing maybe 12 knots max. Tide is all the way out as well, so I didn't really want to take my surfboard with massive fins out. Wasn't going to go out at all, but my friend takes his 12m out (he weighs something like 90kg). So I watch him set it up, he goes out with his own TT and boots setup and is boosting and staying upwind and having a great time. So I think what the hell, give it a crack.

I have to say - this thing impressed the **** out of me. I was ready to hate it, and was completely skeptical I was going to get any joy at all out of flying it. Launch was so straightforward, and happened on the grass behind trees with half the wind not even making it in from the beach. Flies a bit high in the window, but I couldn't get over the lift I was getting. Then go out on my own TT and boots setup with like tiny 28mm fins, and usually where I would be struggling with anything, I am staying upwind just fine, and managing to load and pop and dangle a bit, few backrolls, etc without any issues. Didn't have the balls to unhook or darkslide or anything silly on my first time out with it, but it felt like I could, if that makes sense.

The bar pressure is super light and the pull is actually really really gentle.. The thing obviously turns a bit slower, and is way more forgiving with me pulling the bar all the way in when compared to an inflatable but it honestly didn't feel much different. It kissed the water once but didn't lose it or need to relaunch at all so not sure how awful that is when it happens. But yeah, it was honestly like kiting on a cloud. It was only like a 1 hour session but I didn't come in with a sore back like I usually do.

Anyways, so call me impressed. I thought foil kites were stupid and foiling looked lame but I may just be a convert. Obviously have nothing to compare it to, but for the first time out on a foil kite, everything from launch to kiting on a friggin TT and boots was pretty damned enjoyable. Even the land and packup wasn't that bad. Either way it's added another dimension to kiting and I can probably now go out in conditions I couldnt before and have a halfway decent session. Can't wait to try it on a SB.

Also thanks Marv for replying to your FB messages quickly and sorting me out without any delays! And congrats on your new kid.

Puetz
NT, 2127 posts
3 Aug 2018 10:06AM
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... nice review

GeoffD
WA, 60 posts
3 Aug 2018 9:20AM
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chino said..
So, full disclosure. I've been asked to write this review by Marv, normally I wouldn't bother. But I just texted him to say how happy I am with his service and the kite and I was asked to write a positive review so I am.

I've been happy in my little freestyle/wakestyle rut for 5+ years, and have been upgrading boards and kites every 1-2 years but haven't progressed much. Still ride C-kites with a TT and boots and do some basic unhooked stuff, but don't really boost high, etc etc. Lately I've been looking at expanding my sessions into something a little different, and picked up unstrapped on a surfboard and have been enjoying it. And then I stupidly talked to some foilers, and now I am giving that a crack, mostly so I can do some light wind stuff and kite in new countries with a little less wind.

Anyways, so to cut a long story short, I end up buying a Flysurfer Soul 12m from Marvin - it took less than 10 days from the time I messaged him to the time we actually received the kites at our front door - even though I've never flown foil kites (paraglided a bit, but not for 10+ years). My friend buys the exact same kite.

We drive down to Rosie today where it is forecast for 20-30 knots and as usual it's a bluff and blowing maybe 12 knots max. Tide is all the way out as well, so I didn't really want to take my surfboard with massive fins out. Wasn't going to go out at all, but my friend takes his 12m out (he weighs something like 90kg). So I watch him set it up, he goes out with his own TT and boots setup and is boosting and staying upwind and having a great time. So I think what the hell, give it a crack.

I have to say - this thing impressed the **** out of me. I was ready to hate it, and was completely skeptical I was going to get any joy at all out of flying it. Launch was so straightforward, and happened on the grass behind trees with half the wind not even making it in from the beach. Flies a bit high in the window, but I couldn't get over the lift I was getting. Then go out on my own TT and boots setup with like tiny 28mm fins, and usually where I would be struggling with anything, I am staying upwind just fine, and managing to load and pop and dangle a bit, few backrolls, etc without any issues. Didn't have the balls to unhook or darkslide or anything silly on my first time out with it, but it felt like I could, if that makes sense.

The bar pressure is super light and the pull is actually really really gentle.. The thing obviously turns a bit slower, and is way more forgiving with me pulling the bar all the way in when compared to an inflatable but it honestly didn't feel much different. It kissed the water once but didn't lose it or need to relaunch at all so not sure how awful that is when it happens. But yeah, it was honestly like kiting on a cloud. It was only like a 1 hour session but I didn't come in with a sore back like I usually do.

Anyways, so call me impressed. I thought foil kites were stupid and foiling looked lame but I may just be a convert. Obviously have nothing to compare it to, but for the first time out on a foil kite, everything from launch to kiting on a friggin TT and boots was pretty damned enjoyable. Even the land and packup wasn't that bad. Either way it's added another dimension to kiting and I can probably now go out in conditions I couldnt before and have a halfway decent session. Can't wait to try it on a SB.

Also thanks Marv for replying to your FB messages quickly and sorting me out without any delays! And congrats on your new kid.


+1 ^^

I've got the 15 (6'6" and ~ 112kg) - love it. Great light wind kite on the foil; seriously considering getting the 10 for heavier days because it's such a great kite.

chino
VIC, 165 posts
3 Aug 2018 12:16PM
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Puetz said..
... nice review


Gotta bring it up to Darwin and have a play with you guys again! Still remember walk of shaming like 7 years ago at Cas Surf Club with my old 11m core while you and Eddie were just sitting by the beach having cold beers and a laugh

Puetz
NT, 2127 posts
3 Aug 2018 1:33PM
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Select to expand quote
chino said..

Puetz said..
... nice review



Gotta bring it up to Darwin and have a play with you guys again! Still remember walk of shaming like 7 years ago at Cas Surf Club with my old 11m core while you and Eddie were just sitting by the beach having cold beers and a laugh


... we would never have laughed,,,,, but yes we were having a beer or 3!!!

Macster
VIC, 261 posts
6 Aug 2018 8:09PM
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Im the other guy who also got a 12m Soul. I have a 9m Hyperlink too.

The Soul holds its pressure better and stays inflated much longer than the Hyperlink. There's many design aspects that I like about this foil; one year warranty, reinforced stitching, channel at the trailing edge to allow sand out, adjustable bridals, strong fabric etc.

Flying characteristics: loops quicker than I expected (flew on 20m lines). Easily able to complete a downloop when jumping 10m high plus on the way down.

Bar pressure is more than the Hyperlink but not excessive. Sits higher / further forward in the wind window than the hyperlink and might need a bit of depower when parked over head.

Haven't tried on foil board yet, cant wait!

Thanks also Marv for your great aervice. More comparisons / reviews to come later.

INTHELOOP
QLD, 1855 posts
11 Aug 2018 10:22AM
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Hi mate,
i found the bar pressure to be a lot less than on Hyperlink. Maybe your experience is because of the size difference between 9 and 12m? Usually smaller kites have less bar pressure. Also what bar/lines are you using? The location of the V-Splitter can make a difference.. 20m lines will be nice inStrong winds especially for boosting huge with lots of hang time.
Dont be shy to go down to 15m lines with the Hydrofoil.

This new generation of foilkite is so much fun, user-friendly with a huge range of use. Flysurfer has worked hard for many years ( i was involved with testing in Dubai) to make this kite a special follower of the iconic Speed and the feedback from riders ( beginners to pros) worldwide is incredible.

daddycool
WA, 322 posts
13 Aug 2018 2:05PM
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I use TT when windy for boosting and messing around and go foiling in light/medium winds. Have used Rebels for former and foil race kites for latter. My gamble with the 12m SOUL was to bridge the gap which I have to admit is a stretch. The compact approach to travel (no pump , lighter weight etc) as it comes in a small compact zip up bag is a bonus . After a few sessions spanning 12knots to 20Knots I can report that this kite delivers as advertised. It really does have a lot of the benefits of a foil (upwind ability, low wind stay in the air ability etc etc) whilst maintaining the feel of a tube kite. It appears to be extremely well made and has user friendly features such as self draining, easy relaunch and the like.
As more free-riders mix foiling and TT I think this kite is a winner (despite the price!). Specialist wave riders and the freestyle tricksters prob not , neither the specialist racers - everyone else - a resounding yes! I am gambling this will see me from 10knots on a foil with 24m lines up to 25knots on a TT with 20m lines. plus very compact for travel. Have already let the race foils kites go and am close to letting the Rebels go (10m and 13m) but still got some hours to do on a TT in strong winds before making the leap.....

BrisKites
QLD, 1242 posts
14 Aug 2018 12:59PM
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I didn't find the bar pressure to be any lighter than the Hyperlink. Both kites have their own merits.
The new tuning features on the Soul are outstanding though.If anybody in our area wants to test a SOUL just hit us up.






Stu101
117 posts
3 Sep 2018 7:44AM
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I really want a 15m looks an awesome kite and real impressive!

sonny2727
VIC, 118 posts
9 Sep 2018 6:53AM
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Select to expand quote
Bossstyle said..
I really want a 15m looks an awesome kite and real impressive!


thanks for the info ..it's very useful

Stu101
117 posts
12 Nov 2018 7:46AM
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Select to expand quote
sonny2727 said..



Bossstyle said..
I really want a 15m looks an awesome kite and real impressive!





thanks for the info ..it's very useful


Well I bought one Sonny, and sold it again. The 15m is a great kite. Hang time best I have had in last ten years of kiting! Not so good for small launch spaces and launching in higher ranges. Low end was amazing too though. However I found it a little slow and that put timings for jumps and things out a little. Want it to be a little faster and little more range in the mid Wind range so just flogged it and ordered the 12m replacement. :-)
cant wait to try that beast now!

sonny2727
VIC, 118 posts
13 Nov 2018 7:04PM
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Select to expand quote
Bossstyle said..

sonny2727 said..




Bossstyle said..
I really want a 15m looks an awesome kite and real impressive!






thanks for the info ..it's very useful



Well I bought one Sonny, and sold it again. The 15m is a great kite. Hang time best I have had in last ten years of kiting! Not so good for small launch spaces and launching in higher ranges. Low end was amazing too though. However I found it a little slow and that put timings for jumps and things out a little. Want it to be a little faster and little more range in the mid Wind range so just flogged it and ordered the 12m replacement. :-)
cant wait to try that beast now!


I think Soul is better in sizes 12m down , i'd think higher AR kite like Sonic 2 would be better 15m and up

Macster
VIC, 261 posts
13 Nov 2018 7:25PM
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I have the 12m. Word of warning the hang time is huge and loops are very powerful even in 15 knots on a twin tip

I'm battling some minor whiplash this week cause I threw a front roll kiteloop on the weekend, misjudged the hang time, over rotated then took the full force of the kiteloop head first backwards!

I usually use my souls for foiling boarding but from time to time will use them on a twin tip. You really need to dial in the timing differences if you're gonna use them for looping tricks!

dafish
NSW, 1361 posts
14 Nov 2018 6:41AM
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Macster said..
I have the 12m. Word of warning the hang time is huge and loops are very powerful even in 15 knots on a twin tip

I'm battling some minor whiplash this week cause I threw a front roll kiteloop on the weekend, misjudged the hang time, over rotated then took the full force of the kiteloop head first backwards!

I usually use my souls for foiling boarding but from time to time will use them on a twin tip. You really need to dial in the timing differences if you're gonna use them for looping tricks!



With a kite like that and the long hang time do you need to loop for a soft landing, or does it just gradually come in for touch down? I have never owned a foil and only had a brief fly of a Hyperlink

SaveTheWhales
WA, 1662 posts
14 Nov 2018 8:23AM
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Macster said..
I have the 12m. Word of warning the hang time is huge and loops are very powerful even in 15 knots on a twin tip

I'm battling some minor whiplash this week cause I threw a front roll kiteloop on the weekend, misjudged the hang time, over rotated then took the full force of the kiteloop head first backwards!

I usually use my souls for foiling boarding but from time to time will use them on a twin tip. You really need to dial in the timing differences if you're gonna use them for looping tricks!


Glad to hear your sharing in the White knuckles award of the year comp

eddiemorgs
NT, 359 posts
14 Nov 2018 11:43AM
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Select to expand quote
Puetz said..

chino said..


Puetz said..
... nice review




Gotta bring it up to Darwin and have a play with you guys again! Still remember walk of shaming like 7 years ago at Cas Surf Club with my old 11m core while you and Eddie were just sitting by the beach having cold beers and a laugh



... we would never have laughed,,,,, but yes we were having a beer or 3!!!


We've all done the walk of shame mate .... and still do occasionally

Macster
VIC, 261 posts
14 Nov 2018 4:32PM
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Select to expand quote
dafish said..

Macster said..
I have the 12m. Word of warning the hang time is huge and loops are very powerful even in 15 knots on a twin tip

I'm battling some minor whiplash this week cause I threw a front roll kiteloop on the weekend, misjudged the hang time, over rotated then took the full force of the kiteloop head first backwards!

I usually use my souls for foiling boarding but from time to time will use them on a twin tip. You really need to dial in the timing differences if you're gonna use them for looping tricks!




With a kite like that and the long hang time do you need to loop for a soft landing, or does it just gradually come in for touch down? I have never owned a foil and only had a brief fly of a Hyperlink


Nah. Looping is not really necessary. It's funny but you develop muscle memory and I struggle to do some basic tricks like back rolls and front rolls without a kiteloop. The 8m Soul is pretty good for looping on 17m lines

daddycool
WA, 322 posts
16 Nov 2018 12:43PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
sonny2727 said..


Bossstyle said..



sonny2727 said..






Bossstyle said..
I really want a 15m looks an awesome kite and real impressive!








thanks for the info ..it's very useful





Well I bought one Sonny, and sold it again. The 15m is a great kite. Hang time best I have had in last ten years of kiting! Not so good for small launch spaces and launching in higher ranges. Low end was amazing too though. However I found it a little slow and that put timings for jumps and things out a little. Want it to be a little faster and little more range in the mid Wind range so just flogged it and ordered the 12m replacement. :-)
cant wait to try that beast now!




I think Soul is better in sizes 12m down , i'd think higher AR kite like Sonic 2 would be better 15m and up



Have 12m and 18m SOUL's which serve well for foiling and TT 80% of the time. (Im 100+kgs)....have a 10m LEI for the really windy (25+) days.
The 18m is a sweet kite as It can turn quicker than the race style Sonics and is way more forgiving. Ive used it up to 18knots on short lines (17m) on a TT and as low as 8 knots on 24m lines with the foil. For less chubby folk out there I think the 15m / 10m combo is a potential winner!




Stu101
117 posts
31 Jul 2019 7:25AM
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I sold the 12m though I liked it a lot. It was still a little slow turning wise. I now have the 10m. The 10m is a beast it is way closer to an Lei in turning speed. The 10m soul steers like an 11m Lei which to me is the perfect speed. Fast enough to throw about which you couldn't really say you could do on the 12m or 15m. Because you can throw it about it also means you can generate apparent wind quickly when needed and once you are up well it just pulls like a train same as the larger ones so actually I haven't lost all that much low end compared with the bigger versions. It still gets me out and out performs those on 17m Lei Kites in the same winds they are using. The main difference being in the soul you can boost and boost high from practically standing still where as the large Lei need speed and on in light stuff can't get anywhere near as high. :-) this actually makes a super difference and is a massive pro. You can actually be very relaxed with the souls. While people are speeding around you in order generate lift from their Lei kites you can plod along like an old fart and when you want send it and still easily go as high the other advantage is if you want to go fast just sign it once or twice and again you will power past the Lei guys. The 10m has impressive speed for a small wing. I absolutely love this kite! It is awesome. I liked the 15m I really liked the 12m but the 10m is the money kite! If I could only have one it would be the 10m for sure.

eppo
WA, 7159 posts
31 Jul 2019 8:02AM
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From the sounds of the different sized kites performances I'm thinking the 9m would be a perfect size in our summer conditions here ... ?? I'm only extrapolating from what you guys have said. What do you think ?

ActionSportsWA
WA, 697 posts
31 Jul 2019 11:16AM
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Hi guys,

Just back from a very windy trip to Mauritius. I went expecting mostly light conditions but packed a 15m, 12m and an 8m Soul for foiling. The first day we got there, the wind was 15-20 knots, with occassional stronger gusts. It was a bit much for the first day on a foil, so I borrowed a Duotone Select and threw up the 12m Soul on my 13m race lines/click bar. We headed upwind to a flat water spot behind the reef and did speed runs and huge boosts. The 12m was superb and easily controlled on the shorter lines. I rarely felt overpowered due to the flat water, however the flat water was flat due to the very shallow coral we were speeding and jumping in. This made landings quite critical.

The jumps on the 12m were truly astounding, so much hangtime at high altitude, easily outjumping the LEI's that were out there. It takes a little while to dial the kite positioning on such short lines and many times I would put the wingtip in the water on landings. With 5m Extensions, the kite had more room to fly and the wingtips stayed dry. Best to set the kite up with a bit of oversheeting to stall the wing to keep it back in the wind window just a bit longer. No need to loop it.

The 10m is a lot quicker and the 8m is very fast and stable. Epic kites for both boosting on a TT and flying around on a foil in light to strong winds. Boosting in 30 knots on my race foil with short lines on the 8m was freaky good.

DM

djdojo
VIC, 1528 posts
31 Jul 2019 7:13PM
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DM (and others) what's your favourite line length for old school twintip boosting and freeride on the 12m. I don't have a Soul (strange thing to say) but I have recently acquired a V1 Diablo 12m (lower aspect than later versions and thus perhaps more comparable to the soul) and wondering what to chop my lines down to. And maybe run 4 or 5m extensions? 16+4? 15+5?

ActionSportsWA
WA, 697 posts
1 Aug 2019 1:40PM
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Hey Dojo,

I was running 18m (my race bar has 13m) with 5m extensions. I find the kite responds faster and allows you to control it when really powered up. Flysurfer bar and lines are 17 + 3. In lighter winds the 20m would be ideal, I recommend 17/18 when powered up on a TT. On a race foil you can run as short as 12m.

I feel the 20m is a bit long on a TT when powered as they produce so much lift and it takes them time to redirect for a jump that it's more difficult to hold your edge and you are more likely to jump low and long rather than high and floaty.

Diablo might be a little cantancerous in terms of wing tip stability, but just check the mixer bridles for stretch and you should be OK.

DM

Both the following pics are on 13m lines





djdojo
VIC, 1528 posts
2 Aug 2019 9:05AM
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Cheers DM, that aligns with what others have said. Mixer looks good according to F-one tuning diagram and I've flown it on the beach in 6/7 knots without too much in the way of wingtip challenges. Reckon I'll go with 17+3. Time to get splicing!

Macster
VIC, 261 posts
2 Aug 2019 12:01PM
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All personal preference. I made some 15m lines, used them 3 times and went back to 17m lines. At 15m lines it was too hard to complete a downloop without grabbing a steering line on the 12m but the 8m Soul was ok.

Now that I'm making my own bar and lines for about $150 each I will have bars in the following line lengths ready to go for my foil kites:

15m, 17, 20, 23 and 25.

eppo
WA, 7159 posts
2 Aug 2019 12:28PM
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Sorry but shouldn't it downloop sooner on shorter lines ? Or are you talking about the wingtip hitting the water. So these new foils are still damn slow by the sounds of it ??

ActionSportsWA
WA, 697 posts
2 Aug 2019 2:44PM
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Hey Eppo,

The wingspan of a 10m Soul is roughly 7m. If you have the kite at 12 o'clock on 15m lines, it needs to pivot on its inside wingtip to clear the water surface when looping on a TT. Running on 17-18m lines gives ample room for downturn. Bigger kites (18-21sqm) require pulling on the leader line, especially on short lines. You can even downturn a 21m kite on 15m lines with proper race technique (ie gybing).

DM

eppo
WA, 7159 posts
2 Aug 2019 2:46PM
Thumbs Up

Yep. Ta daz

Macster
VIC, 261 posts
2 Aug 2019 8:17PM
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Select to expand quote
ActionSportsWA said..
Hey Eppo,

The wingspan of a 10m Soul is roughly 7m. If you have the kite at 12 o'clock on 15m lines, it needs to pivot on its inside wingtip to clear the water surface when looping on a TT. Running on 17-18m lines gives ample room for downturn. Bigger kites (18-21sqm) require pulling on the leader line, especially on short lines. You can even downturn a 21m kite on 15m lines with proper race technique (ie gybing).

DM


Yep, what he said. Hard to clear a wing tip using bar only to turn the loop you really have to fishpole dead at 12pm on the 15m lines with a 12m kite. 17m lines are all good though.

omg
138 posts
3 Aug 2019 4:37AM
Thumbs Up

FWIW, I only use the 12m for very marginal wind riding. 6 knots and up to 10 knots or so, for foilboarding when launching the kite. I have 29 meter lines, and find them nice for our gusty launch spot (flat island with a small house upwind of the launch place) and with longer lines, the kite is flying in cleaner winds and I can make loops for foil starting as effective as I can imagine with that 12m size. If it's more, I?ll take 12m LEI. Have 633 Onda and weigh 80 kgs.



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"Flysurfer Soul 12m" started by chino